28 July 2009 @ 12:33 pm
Torchwood Meta: On CoE and Why It's Bad Drama  
This is very long. It's my way to express to myself my dissatisfaction with CoE.  Don't read it you don't want to. The next chapter of Andy's story coming up tomorrow!

            One of the reasons I left Star Trek fandom yea many years ago was that I was utterly bored with the arguments about “story” versus “characters.” You know, the people who would say the character has to do that action in order to advance the story versus that action is very out of character for that individual and therefore unbelievable. The two aligned along the “hard’ versus “soft” science-fiction axis, though not totally.

 

            There seems to be a similar division in the reactions to CoE, which would be totally understandable IF THE STORY WERE A GOOD ONE. But it isn’t. Not even by television standards, which is a low bar to set indeed. And the worst part about it is that the wounds are, as they say, self-inflicted.

           First, if you’re a Torchwood fan but not a Doctor Who fan, some of these things might carry less weight, but bear with me. Torchwood belongs, or did, until this series, in the Whoniverse. There are certain conventions about this Universe which are utterly disregarded in CoE. In The Christmas Invasion, the Doctor tells the Sycorax to go home and tell all other alien races to keep their paws off Earth: tell whoever you meet that the Earth is defended. Now, that doesn’t stop the aliens from trying, but… there is always a defense. Until now.  I’d like to see the Doctor’s explanation when Jack calls him on it. Do you think they will make the Doctor into the kind of monster who says it was for the good of mankind? Or sorry Jack, everyone you love is expendable anyway and buck up, there'll be others? Or even worse, have the Doctor indulge in one of his tiresome pity-parties?

 

            Another convention disregarded is the whole idea of UNIT as a warlike group that would shoot at anything that moves. In Journey’s End, Martha is sent by UNIT to use something called the Osterhagen Key, a device that would destroy the Earth by detonating nuclear warheads, rather than let it fall into the hands of the Daleks. I just watched Planet of the Dead. In this particular instance the UNIT people are called to deal with a wormhole. Their commander lines them up in front of it and says, pretty much, whatever comes through, shoot it dead.  So UNIT would accept orders to capitulate without a single shot?

 

            The biggest and best is a little something called the Shadow Proclamation. It’s a large organization which maintains order among races, including employing a set of enforcers called the Judoon. Often the Doctor would quote its treaties and conventions to emphasize that he had the right to act against beings that did not conform to its dictates. In fact in The Stolen Earth the Doctor is asked to lead the forces of the Shadow Proclamation against whoever was stealing planets. What are the odds that Jack, considering where/when he was born, an experienced Time Agent, and a Companion, wouldn’t have known about it? And, with the communications part of his wrist device thingie, call in the Judoon?

 

            But, you say, but that can be explained away one way or the other. All right, I say, then let’s talk character in action:

 

            Martha Jones, the woman who walked the Earth for a year and defeated a mad Time Lord in the process can’t find a way to get back to London

 

            Sarah Jane Smith, a former Companion with a supercomputer and a superintelligent mechanical dog, never even bothers to try to do anything…

 

            Jack Harkness, a man who we are told has spent over one hundred years preparing for the moment where everything changes, doesn’t have a plan. A successful conman and thief, not to mention successful Time Agent, can’t figure out some way to deal with these aliens and flails about like a tyro, to the point that he has to be given instructions on how to steal from his least experienced agent. And even worse, the man we have been told for two series is the one who will do the bad thing, the nasty thing, no matter how bad and nasty, in order to save the Earth, has to be motivated by the death of his lover to sacrifice his grandson…

 

            Ianto Jones, the man who keeps everything going in Torchwood by making sure everything works as it should, doesn’t lock his car well enough so thieves get to it, and forgets to pick up a gas mask even though he knows the aliens live in a poisonous atmosphere…

 

            Everyone one in the government, except one lone temp, is a coward and a poltroon. Now, I know bureaucrats suck, but, honestly, not one to raise a ruckus?... Even in the Bourne movies there are at least two good government types…

 

            Everyone is terrified of these aliens, who the last time they were on Earth, didn’t really threaten much, instead, they offered a vaccine in trade, a vaccine that healed millions…

 

            Any one of us can think of three or four ways in which Ianto would still be dead but the response from the fans would be totally different.  Can you imagine how different it would have been if Ianto had died saving Steven? But at bottom, the whole CoE arc is bad plotting. Which, to be honest, is not unusual in Torchwood and Doctor Who. The thing that attracts us to these two shows is the characters. All the quirky, insane, brilliant, terrible, silly people that make up the Whoniverse, and who always, until now, acted according to their character. Without them, it all falls apart.

 

 
 
( Post a new comment )
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:01 pm (UTC)
*comes out of lurkdom*

That's essentially my feelings on COE (which I won't be watching for a long time but I know the major things that happen)

I've come to terms with Ianto's death, and agree with RTD (to a degree), that it made it more realistic. However he assassinated his characters' characters, and that I find inexcusable.

I personally believe he's used COE as a way to clean house so he can rebuild it around Gwen or Gwen's child (who will be just like Gwen). Something like 'Oh this didn't turn out how I intended why don't I use series 3 to get rid of everything and try again and this time they WILL like who I want them to in the way I want them to.'

If series 4 turns out the way I anticipate I most definitely won't even consider watching and Torchwood will likely end.

*is wondering what is about COE posts that makes me leave lurkdom*
[identity profile] merucha.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:04 pm (UTC)
As I said, I wouldn't have been pissed off at Ianto's death if it wasn't such a... lousy plot device. It's Torchwood; people die. But HOW they die is important. Especially in the Whoniverse, where respect for life and the value of the individual is essential.
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:14 pm (UTC)
*nods in agreement*

I really do think though it was also cleaning house. RTD didn't want Ianto around anymore and it was an opportunity to pitch it...actually come to think of it he probably wanted Ianto dead in series 2, I remember reading originally it was suppose to be Ianto that was the zombie, which probably meant a good chance of dying in Exit Wounds, but that pesky director and Burns foiled the plot.

Now I'm wondering how different COE would have been if the characters were ya know in character.
[identity profile] aeron-lanart.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:30 pm (UTC)
Ianto was supposed to die in S1 too - but got a reprieve.

Third time unlucky I suppose.
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:32 pm (UTC)
0.0 hadn't heard anything about that....How was that suppose to happen????????

I now officially have decided RTD didn't like Ianto and wanted him gone, especially since he was taking attention away from a certain character.
[identity profile] aeron-lanart.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:37 pm (UTC)
It was either Death by Lisa or Death by Cannibal (not sure which) but I think they re-wrote while they were filming Cyberwoman as GDL impressed them.
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:39 pm (UTC)
Way to go GDL! Give the series more depth despite their best intentions (because Ianto brought something extra and special to it that was subtle but was great).
[identity profile] merucha.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:39 pm (UTC)
And by the second series, they had a bonafide hit COUPLE on their hands -- and it wasn't Jack and Gwen!
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:49 pm (UTC)
Which I'm sure RTD loved.....
[identity profile] faithharkness.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:49 pm (UTC)
And actually, they originally planned to kill Ianto in S1 as well, but the character caught on.

Which, now that I read the WHOLE thread, I realize was already mentioned. D'oh!

Edited 2009-07-28 06:51 pm (UTC)
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:52 pm (UTC)
Yes someone mentioned that...I'm not sure it would have been Torchwood or at least as awesome if there'd been no Ianto.
[identity profile] faithharkness.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:55 pm (UTC)
I am now tempted to write a Series One where Ianto died, but still keep Gwen and Jack apart and further develop Tosh and Owen; just to spite RTD.
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:57 pm (UTC)
No not Ianto, that'd make Jack sad :(.

However I do hope someone comes along and writes COE with in character characters, wonder how different it would have been if the characters had behaved the way their suppose to.
[identity profile] faithharkness.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 07:00 pm (UTC)
Ah, but if I work from the premise that they weren't yet in a relationship, I could get tons of mileage out of that....

See, to do the CoE thing, I'd have to watch the whole thing and map a fix. And I'm not quite ready to watch it...yet.
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 07:03 pm (UTC)
Oh yes, I just hope someone who's watched it (I feel sorry for them) does. (not trying to beg for fic)

But also Jack would be very different because being with Ianto is part of what shaped him in the second season, so second season Jack would be very different, if he was in Torchwood at all.
(no subject) - [identity profile] faithharkness.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 07:06 pm (UTC) Expand
(no subject) - [identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 07:09 pm (UTC)
[identity profile] kuroneko-tyger.livejournal.com on July 30th, 2009 03:47 pm (UTC)
*Another lurker pops out of the wood work...*

Something like that was done, can't for the life of me remember who. Someone wrote a fic/is writing a fic where Lisa died before the team found out, and Ianto committed suicide. It gets better though! If you don't know it, I'll look up my bookarks when I get home.

*Runs away to read the rest of the comments. Is fascinated by the reaction ppl are having to CoE*
(no subject) - [identity profile] faithharkness.livejournal.com on July 30th, 2009 03:49 pm (UTC) Expand
(no subject) - [identity profile] merucha.livejournal.com on July 30th, 2009 06:08 pm (UTC)
(no subject) - [identity profile] lukita.livejournal.com on August 3rd, 2009 08:43 am (UTC)
[identity profile] faithharkness.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:07 pm (UTC)
However he assassinated his characters' characters, and that I find inexcusable.

THIS. So much this. Character assassination is the worst crime in my opinion. Especially of a character who has had 200+ years of growth.
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:18 pm (UTC)
Hello again.

Yeap, from everything I understand (yes I'm avoiding COE I don't want to witness the assassination) that was not OUR Jack or OUR Ianto, they were shadows of the characters that have been developed.

BTW thank you again for the opinion on where to post a story.
[identity profile] faithharkness.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:45 pm (UTC)
You are very welcome. Holler at me when you post--I'd love to read and although I'm a member of torch_wood, I am notoriously bad about checkling my flist for updates!
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:47 pm (UTC)
Actually it's already posted...I posted it last Thursday. Want the link?
[identity profile] faithharkness.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:52 pm (UTC)
Very much so, please! I can save it to read over my long weekend!

Sorry for hijacking comments, Emma!
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:55 pm (UTC)
http://community.livejournal.com/torch_wood/5172914.html

There it is (sorry merucha if this is uncalled for). I was really worried I was OOC but no one has said anything.
[identity profile] faithharkness.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 06:57 pm (UTC)
Whee! Saved for reading and am adding you to my friends so I can better keep up!
http://cyberdigi.livejournal.com/[identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 07:01 pm (UTC)
Well actually the journal I use is shared between my mother and I. The nick snitchdreamer is actually her (I use the nick digianimegirl), I just kinda started using it when people started friend-locking and I needed to friend to see stuff, then I kinda just high-jacked it. But she doesn't know I've done any writing, I made the conscious decision to keep RL separate from fandom (actually I'm not sure how many lj's she even looks at anymore.

The point of that long speil was we don't actually post on our actual journal much. *sweatdrop*
(no subject) - [identity profile] faithharkness.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 07:03 pm (UTC) Expand
(no subject) - [identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 07:08 pm (UTC)
[identity profile] merucha.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 07:01 pm (UTC)
Bloody marvelous!
(no subject) - [identity profile] cyberdigi.livejournal.com on July 28th, 2009 07:05 pm (UTC)